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Раздел Войны и военные » Войны и генеалогия военных » Войны и военные Российской Империи нач. XX в.
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Фотографии военных

= фото, увы, не просматривается
Автором указаны даты 1858-1917, 1920 гг.

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Модераторы: Wojciech, chayka, ГЕРОдот, tatust
VC

VC

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Наверх   ## 24 апреля 2019 19:28

toryc написал:
[q]
I'm looking for information on this photo of my great, great grandfather. We were told that his name was Michael Jurkela or Jurkin- probably an anglicized version. We were told that he and others were executed by a Bolshevik firing squad in or around 1919. I am hoping to find his actual name and also if anyone can tell me anything about the branch of the military or the rank by his uniform. He is the man sitting. We do not know the identity of the man standing but would appreciate information on him also.
[/q]
The photo was taken during WWI or the Civil War. Both are officers. Two stars on shoulder boards represent the rank of podporuchik (second lieutenant). Looks like the one standing on the right wears the badge of the Aleksandr’s Military School (Александровское военное училище) located in Moscow. The picture is too blurry to read cyphers on shoulder boards of you great grandfather who sits on the left. It indicates the unit where he served at that time. I think the first digit is 4. Is it possible to scan this area of the picture with the 1200 dpi resolution?

toryc
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Наверх   ## 25 апреля 2019 2:32 25 апреля 2019 2:32

VC написал:
[q]

toryc wrote:
[q]

I'm great for a great grandfather. Michael Jurkela or Jurkin - probably an anglicized version. We’ve been in 1919. I’m hoping to get in touch with him. He is the man sitting. We would not appreciate you.
[/ q]
The photo was taken during WWI or the Civil War. Both are officers. Two stars on shoulder boards represent the second lieutenant (rank second podporuchik). It is located in Moscow. You can see it on the left. It indicates the unit where it served. It is possible to scan this area with the 1200 dpi resolution?

[/q]



Thank you! I do not have the photo. I will ask for it.
toryc
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Наверх   ## 28 апреля 2019 8:34
[ Ответ на сообщение VC ]


428 or 423. Do either of those sound correct?
Derevo105
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Наверх   ## 30 апреля 2019 14:26
Доброго дня!.что можно сказать по этому фото?..полк?.

Прикрепленный файл: image (75).jpg
VC

VC

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Наверх   ## 2 мая 2019 20:11 2 мая 2019 20:12

toryc написал:
[q]
428 or 423. Do either of those sound correct?
[/q]
Sorry for the late reply. Either one is a possibility. If it is really a large three-digit number (above 400) and not a combination of numerals and letters, then it’s likely an infantry regiment. I doubt it’s 423 though. The top part of the digit 3 used on Russian army shoulder boards was straight. It seems to me that on the photo this part of the last digit is curved so 428 sounds like a better choice. See for yourself:
https://gwar.mil.ru/army/839/
https://gwar.mil.ru/army/833/

There is another tricky thing - at different periods during the WWI there were two infantry regiments with the number 428. Initially it was Старицкий (Staritsky) regiment which later got number 462. The number 428 was then assigned to Лодейнопольский (Lodeynopolsky) regiment which kept it till the end of the war. I don’t know the story behind the switch. I saw some references online to Lodeynopolsky regiment being stationed in Finland at the end of WWI.

I couldn’t find an officer with the name Mihail Jurkin being mentioned anywhere. Are you sure that the name is correct?
VC

VC

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Наверх   ## 2 мая 2019 20:14

Derevo105 написал:
[q]
Доброго дня!.что можно сказать по этому фото?..полк?.
[/q]
Рядовой какого-то гвардейского пехотного или стрелкового полка в лацканном мундире принятом начиная с 1908-го года.

toryc
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Наверх   ## 12 мая 2020 3:10
>> Ответ на сообщение пользователя VC от 2 мая 2019 20:11

Apologies. I never saw your reply. I've been doing more research lately and I just came across new information for him. The stories passed down about him in our family are incorrect. I was just sent a newspaper article from 1916 in Helsinki, where he was living and working as a merchant, about is murder (shot) outside his shop. Other records from Helsinki show that prior to his moving to Helsinki in 1908, he was in Vietka, Belarus. He was only 35 when he was killed. Any thoughts on how these dates might relate to his military service? Some of what he was selling was military uniforms and I am told that would have been unlikely without some connection to the military.

As usual, his name is spelled differently in different records. I'm attaching two to show the differences.

Прикрепленный файл: Helsinki address registry.jpgJurkinin probate letter.jpg, 198312 байт
VC

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Наверх   ## 12 мая 2020 5:28 12 мая 2020 6:53

toryc написал:
[q]
Apologies. I never saw your reply. I've been doing more research lately and I just came across new information for him. The stories passed down about him in our family are incorrect. I was just sent a newspaper article from 1916 in Helsinki, where he was living and working as a merchant, about is murder (shot) outside his shop. Other records from Helsinki show that prior to his moving to Helsinki in 1908, he was in Vietka, Belarus. He was only 35 when he was killed. Any thoughts on how these dates might relate to his military service? Some of what he was selling was military uniforms and I am told that would have been unlikely without some connection to the military.
[/q]
Based on these documents it does not look like he was in the military. He is also listed as a merchant in the Helsingfors address registry (Adressbok och yrkeskalender för Helsingfors) for 1913 and 1915-1916.

I attached the page from the 1915 issue and here is the link to the 1913 registry:
https://digi.kansalliskirjasto...p;ocr=true

This database also lists him as "civilian":
http://vesta.narc.fi/cgi-bin/d...kuid=40761
http://vesta.narc.fi/cgi-bin/d...kuolleet_0

I have doubts that he is either of these two officers. Is this photo signed? Any other info on the back like the place where it was taken? Did he have relatives in the military? Have you heard any other last names mentioned that could have been connected to the family?

Прикрепленный файл: Jurkin.jpg
toryc
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Наверх   ## 13 мая 2020 6:03
>> Ответ на сообщение пользователя VC от 12 мая 2020 5:28

I'm waiting to hear if there is anything on the back, but I'm not sure there is. There is only a stamp on the bottom of the photo from the studio (presumably in Helsinki.) There is actually another photo that would have been taken earlier I think (based on the dates you previously gave for the uniforms and the dress my great great grandmother is wearing) that is badly damaged.

I think you may be right that they are not the same person, but he definitely must be related because my great grandmother and her sisters resemble him.

Unfortunately, I have no other information about the Jurkin family. Until now, we weren't even sure that was the version of the name he used because one daughter used Jurkela and the others used Jurkin. (Although I'm going to look into the Alexander Jurkin listed in the registry.) Learning he was a merchant in Finland and that he was murdered there is the only new information we have found for him in years. When I try to search from here in the United States, I don't get search results for anything. I really appreciate you looking him up. Every little bit of new information helps so thank you!

The only other name I can associate with him is his widow's maiden surname, Raatikainen. I do not know how they met or where. She is listed with different names in different records: Anna Sofia, Sofia, Alma Sofia, Sofia Antonowna. I have trouble finding information on their daughters, too: Pola/Apollinaria/Apolinadia (the Finnish records are the first time we have heard of any name being used other than Pola), Xenia, Maria/Mania/Marie.

Прикрепленный файл: 2 Men and Dogs.pngAlma plus 2s.png, 493703 байт
VC

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Наверх   ## 13 мая 2020 20:55 13 мая 2020 20:56
>> Ответ на сообщение пользователя toryc от 13 мая 2020 6:03

toryc написал:
[q]
There is only a stamp on the bottom of the photo from the studio (presumably in Helsinki.)
[/q]
Yes, seems to be the photo studio "Ortho" in Helsinki. I found other pictures that were taken there.

toryc написал:
[q]
There is actually another photo that would have been taken earlier I think
[/q]
Most probably the second picture has also been taken during the WW1. The resolution is too low to see shoulder boards and whether he has any badges that can give additional info. If you or someone else has access to these pictures is it possible to scan shoulder boards and badges with the 1200 dpi resolution? Or at least the whole photo with the 600 dpi? It would be nice to figure out the number on shoulder boards. Both of these guys have the rank of podporuchik (second lieutenant). During the war all officers were released from military schools with the lower rank of praporschik (ensign) after 3-4 months courses. The higher rank indicates that they either studied for 2 years in a military school before that war or already had one promotion during the war. Both these things increase chances that they can be found. It's also the reason why I think neither of them is Michael Jurkin - they both spent significant time in the military.

toryc написал:
[q]
When I try to search from here in the United States, I don't get search results for anything.
[/q]
Just use various spellings of his name from the documents you have and add Helsinki or Helsingfors to narrow down your search results.
BTW. It seems he was buried at the Hietaniemi cemetery. This page mentions his and his wife names:
5.Михаил Васильевич Юркин 15.09.1880 – 18.02.1916 и Алма Софиа 1882 - 1961 Канада
https://forum.vgd.ru/348/18052/

toryc написал:
[q]
The only other name I can associate with him is his widow's maiden surname, Raatikainen.
[/q]
I tried to guess the Russian spelling of this last name (Ратикайнен ???) and searched the WW1 database (https://gwar.mil.ru/heroes/). Found a nurse and couple enlisted men with that or similar last names but no officers.

toryc написал:
[q]
I have trouble finding information on their daughters
[/q]
That's a common problem. They are probably listed under husbands last names in later documents.
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Модераторы: Wojciech, chayka, ГЕРОдот, tatust
Генеалогический форум » Войны и военные » Войны и генеалогия военных » Войны и военные Российской Империи нач. XX в. » Фотографии военных [тема №4294]
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