Äèëëîó Èîãàíí Ôðèäðèõ

Irina Ol íàïèñàë:

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choxie íàïèñàë:

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ß íå ìîãó ðàçîáðàòü âñþ ëèíèþ, íî ìíå êàæåòñÿ, ÷òî ýòî ïîõîæå íà åãî èìÿ!

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Ó ìåíÿ òîæå çàòðóäíåíèÿ)))
1801 ãîä (?)
5 Àâãóñòà(?) Èîãàíí Ôðè(ä)ðèõ Pat. Äèëëàó ðîäèëñÿ â ïðèõîäå Bahten (Bathen)...

Ïîïðîñèëà ïîìî÷ü çäåñü https://forum.vgd.ru/post/4436/39143/p4908002.htm#pp4908002

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Íà Âàøåé ïðåäûäóùåé êàðòå åñòü Áåíåí Behnen.
Íàõîäèòñÿ â äðóãîì ïîâÿòå, â Òóêóìñêîì, íî ñîâñåì ïðè ãðàíèöå ïîâÿòîâ.

Íà êàðòî÷êå ñ íåìåöêîé òî÷íîñòüþ íàïèñàíî, ÷òî â ìîìåíò ñìåðòè 11 ìàÿ 1882 ãîäà Èîãàíí Ôðèäðèõ èìåë 80 ëåò, 9 ìåñÿöåâ è 6 äíåé.

Ó ìåíÿ ïîëó÷èëîñü êàê ðàç 5 àâãóñòà 1801 ãîäà.

Ïðè ïîñëåäíåì ðàçäåëå Ïîëüøè â 1795 ãîäó ýòè çåìëè (Inflanty) îòîøëè Ðîññèéñêîé Èìïåðèè.
Çàïèñü, ÷òî ðîäèëñÿ â Russland, ïðàâèëüíàÿ.
Gramsden
https://et.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gramzda_kihelkond
Ïóíêò VII
https://books.google.ee/books?...mp;f=false
1912 Kreis Basenpoth
https://www.jewishgen.org/cour...000408.htm

Irina Ol íàïèñàë:

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choxie wrote:

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I can't make out the whole line, but I think it sounds like his name!

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I also have difficulties)))
1801 (?)
August 5 (?) Johann Fri(d)rich Pat. Dillau was born in the parish of Bahten ( Bathen )...

I asked for help here https://forum.vgd.ru/post/4436/39143/p4908002.htm#pp4908002

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Ñïàñèáî çà ýòî, ìíå áûëî áû òðóäíî ïðèäóìàòü, êóäà íàïèñàòü. Åäèíñòâåííîå, ÷òî ìåíÿ èíòåðåñóåò, ýòî ïî÷åìó åãî ðîæäåíèå çàïèñàíî çäåñü, â ïðèõîäñêèõ çàïèñÿõ Ãðàìñäåíà? Ìîæåò áûòü, â áàòåíñêîì ïðèõîäå íå âåëñÿ ñîáñòâåííûé ó÷åò èëè òàì ãäå-òî åñòü äðóãîé ó÷åò?

IrenaWaw íàïèñàë:

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Íà Âàøåé ïðåäûäóùåé êàðòå åñòü Áåíåí Behnen.
Íàõîäèòñÿ â äðóãîì ïîâÿòå, â Òóêóìñêîì, íî ñîâñåì ïðè ãðàíèöå ïîâÿòîâ.

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Ñïàñèáî! Îòìåòèëà:

IrenaWaw íàïèñàë:

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Ìîæåò, â òåêñòå Behnen êàçàíî êàê ìåñòíîñòü,íå êàê ïðèõîä?

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ß óæå òîæå òàê ïîäóìàëà è â ñâî¸ì ñîîáùåíèè èñïðàâèëà.

IrenaWaw íàïèñàë:

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Âîçìîæíî, ê 1820 ãîäó ãðàíèöû ïîâÿòîâ áûëè ïåðåêðîåíû óæå â Ðîññèéñêî Èìïåðèè è ïîýòîìó íà êàðòå Áåíåí â ïîâÿòå Òóêóìñêîì.

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Ãðàíèöû ïîâÿòîâ/ïîâåòîâ/óåçäîâ ìåíÿëèñü, äåéñòâèòåëüíî.

choxie íàïèñàë:

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Åäèíñòâåííîå, ÷òî ìåíÿ èíòåðåñóåò, ýòî ïî÷åìó åãî ðîæäåíèå çàïèñàíî çäåñü, â ïðèõîäñêèõ çàïèñÿõ Ãðàìñäåíà? Ìîæåò áûòü, â áàòåíñêîì ïðèõîäå íå âåëñÿ ñîáñòâåííûé ó÷åò èëè òàì ãäå-òî åñòü äðóãîé ó÷åò?

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Âåðîÿòíî, ïðèõîäñêàÿ êèðõà áûëà â Ãðàìñäåíå.
Îòäåëüíîãî áàòåíñêîãî (áåíåíñêîãî) ïðèõîäà èëè íå áûëî, èëè îí áûë î÷åíü ìàëåíüêèì è ïðè÷èñëÿëñÿ ê Ãðàìñäåíñêîìó.

Êàðòà 1860 ãîäà:

choxie íàïèñàë:

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Ìíå óäàëîñü íàéòè ýòó êàðòó Êóðëÿíäèè 1796 ãîäà ñ ïðèõîäñêèìè îêðóãàìè (åñëè ÿ íå îøèáàþñü â ïîíèìàíèè "Kirchspiel"). Ýòî áûëî ñðàçó ïîñëå ïðèñîåäèíåíèÿ ê Ðîññèè, è âû ìîæåòå âèäåòü, ÷òî Áàõòåí (Ïèëòåí: https://lv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piltenes_apgabals) è Ãðàìñäåí (Ãîëüäèíãåí) íàõîäÿòñÿ â äâóõ ðàçíûõ îêðóãàõ, è, ïîõîæå, â ðàçíûõ öåðêîâíûõ îêðóãàõ.

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Åñëè çàïèñü î ðîæäåíèè è êðåùåíèè Âû íàøëè â åâàíãåëè÷åñêè-ëþòåðàíñêîé ïðèõîäñêîé ìåòðè÷åñêîé êíèãå êèðõè â Ãðàìñäåíå, òî íà ýòî è íóæíî îðèåíòèðîâàòüñÿ - ÿ òàê äóìàþ.
 íàïèñàíèè Áàõòåí-Áåíåí-... ïîêà ðàçíî÷òåíèÿ, íåò åäèíñòâà. Âîçìîæíî, ýòî áûëî èìåíèå, íå îáîçíà÷åííîå íà êàðòå.
Johann-Friedrich ìîã ðîäèòüñÿ â èìåíèè, òàì æå ìîã ïàñòîð è êðåñòèòü, à çàïèñàëè â êíèãó Ãðàìñäåíà, ãäå ñåìüÿ áûëà ïðèõîæàíàìè. À ìîæåò èìåíèå áûëî íåäàëåêî îò Ãðàìñäåíà, íî íå îòìå÷åíî íà êàðòàõ.

Ñåé÷àñ íà òåððèòîðèè Ëàòâèè òðè òîïîíèìà Áàõòåí (ñ êàêîãî âðåìåíè - íå çíàþ):
Bahten, (Ort und Pastorat), Gemeinde Wainoden: Bāta
Bahten, Alt, Gemeinde Wainoden: Vecbāta
Bahten, Groß, Gemeinde Wainoden: Lielbāta. Ãðîñ-Áàõòåí - Óñàäüáà Ãðîñ-Áàõòåí íà êàðòå https://lv.wikipedia.org/wiki/..._nosaukumi

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